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General Food Topics • Re: Storing food in a basement

September 13, 2017 anita 0

Thanks for posting. I’m in the process of moving, and the house I’m buying has a partially finished basement with a high humidity level.

Here’s what has been suggested to me/I’m doing to relieve the problem. (Keeping the water away from the outside of the house goes a long way to relieve inside moisture problems. I realize you said you have a dry basement, but can’t hurt.)

1) Have the immediate exterior (3 or so feet closest to house) regraded to make sure water runs away from the house, rather than toward it when it rains. Keep mulch back from the house by a foot or two. (this helps with insect/termite/carpenter ants etc as well as getting rid of the moisture retaining mulch near the house)

2) Make sure downspouts have extensions, either above or below grade, that carry the water away from the house, rather than just dumping onto the ground beside the house.

3) Window wells should be covered.

4) As others mentioned, concrete is good at wicking, so keep everything off the floor. I will probably end up having the carpeting that is currently down there removed, as it smells musty at the moment (it didn’t earlier in the summer) Yet another thing I was not planning on doing, but such is the situation of buying a different house.)

5) Run dehumidifier, large capacity, and it will go via hose into the sump hole (even though the basement has a high humidity level, the sump pump supposedly never runs) That way it will run as much as necessary, rather than waiting to be dumped.

6) I’m having a duct put in from the heating/ac system into the finished part of the basement. I have to have some heating system changes made anyway, so this will be added to that.

I don’t know if any of those suggestions will help you, but maybe they will help someone.

Statistics: Posted by anita — Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:32 am


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General Food Topics • Re: Storing food in a basement

September 13, 2017 anita 0

Thanks for posting. I’m in the process of moving, and the house I’m buying has a partially finished basement with a high humidity level.

Here’s what has been suggested to me/I’m doing to relieve the problem. (Keeping the water away from the outside of the house goes a long way to relieve inside moisture problems. I realize you said you have a dry basement, but can’t hurt.)

1) Have the immediate exterior (3 or so feet closest to house) regraded to make sure water runs away from the house, rather than toward it when it rains. Keep mulch back from the house by a foot or two. (this helps with insect/termite/carpenter ants etc as well as getting rid of the moisture retaining mulch near the house)

2) Make sure downspouts have extensions, either above or below grade, that carry the water away from the house, rather than just dumping onto the ground beside the house.

3) Window wells should be covered.

4) As others mentioned, concrete is good at wicking, so keep everything off the floor. I will probably end up having the carpeting that is currently down there removed, as it smells musty at the moment (it didn’t earlier in the summer) Yet another thing I was not planning on doing, but such is the situation of buying a different house.)

5) Run dehumidifier, large capacity, and it will go via hose into the sump hole (even though the basement has a high humidity level, the sump pump supposedly never runs) That way it will run as much as necessary, rather than waiting to be dumped.

6) I’m having a duct put in from the heating/ac system into the finished part of the basement. I have to have some heating system changes made anyway, so this will be added to that.

I don’t know if any of those suggestions will help you, but maybe they will help someone.

Statistics: Posted by anita — Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:32 am


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General Food Topics • Re: Storing food in a basement

September 13, 2017 TRex2 0
Fullmoon wrote:
Basement floors are notorious for this kind of thing, the concrete will wick moisture from the ground below it which remains wet from all that rain. I don’t know if a dehumidifier will help with the floor problem. They are designed to remove water vapor from the air but as long as the cement floor wicks water it may be a lost cause. All food items should be placed on 2x4s or shelving, never directly on the floor. Even the buckets should be up off the floor just to be safe. Too much work and money invested to have this happen to your stuff.

Sorry to hear that you had to learn this the hard way. I think this is something we need to address a little more frequently when teaching new preppers how to keep stuff safe and secure.

The wicking of moisture from the ground is known to people who design reinforced concrete, although I was taught that it is only significant for a couple of inches. We were taught to make sure the rebar was at least two and a half inches from the surface of the concrete to prevent corrosion. Cement block walls are a different animal. I have seen water wick through 10 inch cement blocks at such a rate it ran down the walls, and when we tried to coat them with sealant, it eventually pushed the sealant off of the blocks. Of course, that basement had totally saturated soil outside of the walls (design flaw).
Lesson:
Be sure not to overlook any contact points between stuff and the walls.

When I worked in logistics, we were taught never to put anything that could mold in contact with concrete, but that was because, unless the air is desert dry, the point where anything comes into contact with concrete will attract moisture like a magnet. Every thing went on pallets. In my own storage system, I just use an expendable piece of wood between the stuff and the floor.

The dehumidifier will just about (but not completely, unless you already live in a dry climate) cure the problem with moisture in the totes. But, while the dehumidifier will help with the moisture from the floor, but it won’t cure it, so lessons 4, 5, and 6 never go away.

Statistics: Posted by TRex2 — Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:36 am


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General Food Topics • Re: Storing food in a basement

September 13, 2017 TRex2 0
Fullmoon wrote:
Basement floors are notorious for this kind of thing, the concrete will wick moisture from the ground below it which remains wet from all that rain. I don’t know if a dehumidifier will help with the floor problem. They are designed to remove water vapor from the air but as long as the cement floor wicks water it may be a lost cause. All food items should be placed on 2x4s or shelving, never directly on the floor. Even the buckets should be up off the floor just to be safe. Too much work and money invested to have this happen to your stuff.

Sorry to hear that you had to learn this the hard way. I think this is something we need to address a little more frequently when teaching new preppers how to keep stuff safe and secure.

The wicking of moisture from the ground is known to people who design reinforced concrete, although I was taught that it is only significant for a couple of inches. We were taught to make sure the rebar was at least two and a half inches from the surface of the concrete to prevent corrosion. Cement block walls are a different animal. I have seen water wick through 10 inch cement blocks at such a rate it ran down the walls, and when we tried to coat them with sealant, it eventually pushed the sealant off of the blocks. Of course, that basement had totally saturated soil outside of the walls (design flaw).
Lesson:
Be sure not to overlook any contact points between stuff and the walls.

When I worked in logistics, we were taught never to put anything that could mold in contact with concrete, but that was because, unless the air is desert dry, the point where anything comes into contact with concrete will attract moisture like a magnet. Every thing went on pallets. In my own storage system, I just use an expendable piece of wood between the stuff and the floor.

The dehumidifier will just about (but not completely, unless you already live in a dry climate) cure the problem with moisture in the totes. But, while the dehumidifier will help with the moisture from the floor, but it won’t cure it, so lessons 4, 5, and 6 never go away.

Statistics: Posted by TRex2 — Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:36 am


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General Food Topics • Re: Storing food in a basement

September 13, 2017 Fullmoon 0

Basement floors are notorious for this kind of thing, the concrete will wick moisture from the ground below it which remains wet from all that rain. I don’t know if a dehumidifier will help with the floor problem. They are designed to remove water vapor from the air but as long as the cement floor wicks water it may be a lost cause. All food items should be placed on 2x4s or shelving, never directly on the floor. Even the buckets should be up off the floor just to be safe. Too much work and money invested to have this happen to your stuff.

Statistics: Posted by Fullmoon — Tue Sep 12, 2017 10:26 pm


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General Food Topics • Re: Storing food in a basement

September 13, 2017 Fullmoon 0

Basement floors are notorious for this kind of thing, the concrete will wick moisture from the ground below it which remains wet from all that rain. I don’t know if a dehumidifier will help with the floor problem. They are designed to remove water vapor from the air but as long as the cement floor wicks water it may be a lost cause. All food items should be placed on 2x4s or shelving, never directly on the floor. Even the buckets should be up off the floor just to be safe. Too much work and money invested to have this happen to your stuff.

Statistics: Posted by Fullmoon — Tue Sep 12, 2017 10:26 pm


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General Food Topics • Storing food in a basement

September 13, 2017 angie_nrs 0

At the beginning of the summer I finished my basement. We coated the floor with garage floor sealant and then covered it with a very thin carpeting just to make it a bit more comfy. We also painted all the walls with a latex sealant and then painted (with regular paint) over that. I thought the basement would be good to go since it seemed solid up to that point as we never had any water leaks or problems even though we got a ton of rain this spring and summer.

This summer I started putting canned goods and such down there. So, boxes of canned goods have been sitting there for a few months. I left boxes stacked on the floor and planned to organize it all in early fall. I just got some storage racks put together and was starting to get things put in their appropriate place today. When I was picking up boxes from the floor, I noticed that the cardboard was just slightly moist on the bottom boxes. Also, some of my homemade canned goods had that white mold film on the outside of the glass jars. I guess I underestimated the role of humidity coming from the floor in the basement. It stays closed up for the most part, but it’s not air tight. It’s always much cooler down there. Temps are usually in the 50’s or maybe low 60’s on hot days. I guess I should’ve kept the dehumidifier down there b/c I checked a plastic tote (that was on the floor) that had 6 packs of salt in it (along with some other things) and the salt was hard as a rock and the paper on the bottom of them looked moist. Grrrrrrr! So glad salt is cheap! The salt I stored in a bucket was fine.

So here’s some lessons learned for anyone considering doing the same thing.

1. Keep a humidity reader in your basement on the floor.
2. Keep a dehumidifier in your basement!
3. Don’t store anything directly on the floor, even if it’s in a tote.
4. Keep in mind that totes won’t keep air out of the box. Only sealed buckets will do that.
5. Keep things stored on racks to keep things off the floor and make it easier to keep an eye on things.
6. Don’t just store it and forget it. You have to keep checking things to make sure they are holding up OK.

I’m glad I found all of this out before I started storing my books and photos down there. Once I get the excess water out of the air and keep the dehumidifier on, i’m hoping it will be problem solved. I guess I should’ve invested in floor padding……too late now.

Statistics: Posted by angie_nrs — Tue Sep 12, 2017 10:08 pm


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General Food Topics • Storing food in a basement

September 13, 2017 angie_nrs 0

At the beginning of the summer I finished my basement. We coated the floor with garage floor sealant and then covered it with a very thin carpeting just to make it a bit more comfy. We also painted all the walls with a latex sealant and then painted (with regular paint) over that. I thought the basement would be good to go since it seemed solid up to that point as we never had any water leaks or problems even though we got a ton of rain this spring and summer.

This summer I started putting canned goods and such down there. So, boxes of canned goods have been sitting there for a few months. I left boxes stacked on the floor and planned to organize it all in early fall. I just got some storage racks put together and was starting to get things put in their appropriate place today. When I was picking up boxes from the floor, I noticed that the cardboard was just slightly moist on the bottom boxes. Also, some of my homemade canned goods had that white mold film on the outside of the glass jars. I guess I underestimated the role of humidity coming from the floor in the basement. It stays closed up for the most part, but it’s not air tight. It’s always much cooler down there. Temps are usually in the 50’s or maybe low 60’s on hot days. I guess I should’ve kept the dehumidifier down there b/c I checked a plastic tote (that was on the floor) that had 6 packs of salt in it (along with some other things) and the salt was hard as a rock and the paper on the bottom of them looked moist. Grrrrrrr! So glad salt is cheap! The salt I stored in a bucket was fine.

So here’s some lessons learned for anyone considering doing the same thing.

1. Keep a humidity reader in your basement on the floor.
2. Keep a dehumidifier in your basement!
3. Don’t store anything directly on the floor, even if it’s in a tote.
4. Keep in mind that totes won’t keep air out of the box. Only sealed buckets will do that.
5. Keep things stored on racks to keep things off the floor and make it easier to keep an eye on things.
6. Don’t just store it and forget it. You have to keep checking things to make sure they are holding up OK.

I’m glad I found all of this out before I started storing my books and photos down there. Once I get the excess water out of the air and keep the dehumidifier on, i’m hoping it will be problem solved. I guess I should’ve invested in floor padding……too late now.

Statistics: Posted by angie_nrs — Tue Sep 12, 2017 10:08 pm


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General Food Topics • Re: Electric vs Gas Operated Stoves and Ovens

September 5, 2017 ToolsOfSurvival 0

I’m not sure I’d feel much more comfortable with either gas or electric in a serious emergency situation. I think they both have vulnerabilities. What makes me feel more comfortable and secure is having redundancy and alternatives. As others have already mentioned, there are many other cooking fuels and tools that could be a solid backup plan in the event that either your gas or electric stove weren’t working. Propane and butane are two easy options. Butane has the advantage of being safe to use indoors. Butane stoves are also incredibly inexpensive. You can also store wood and charcoal as cooking fuels. One really important tool that I think every home should have is a solar oven of some type. Solar ovens can be used to cook food on sunny days, preserving your Propane, Butane, wood, and other fuels for non-sunny days when a solar oven can’t be used. By using a solar oven on all sunny days that allow for it, you’ll be stretching out the amount of time that your other fuel sources can last. Something to consider.

Statistics: Posted by ToolsOfSurvival — Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:15 pm


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General Food Topics • Re: hi how do i get golden apples

August 31, 2017 DR1VENbyKNOWLEDGE 0

OK, first thing…

Go to the secret fairy in the Red Glen south of the troll bridge. Don’t forget to promise the troll a golden feather or he wont let you pass!!!

Then when the fairy queen appears in the Red Glen tickle her left toe with the “Everlasting Tickle Rod” you get at the beginning of the game from the fairy lord when he appears in the kings chamber.

The fairy queen will then transport you to the “Fields of Forever” and you’ll find the Golden apple orchards there.

Sleep there three days and there will be some Golden apples to harvest. Punch the trees 20 times to harvest them. Watch out for any that have the green Worms of Woe in them. Those ones are poisons.

This should work……. If it doesn’t, try going to a gaming website instead of a preppers forum. You might have better luck there. :rofl:

Happy elf smashing…
~D

Statistics: Posted by DR1VENbyKNOWLEDGE — Thu Aug 31, 2017 9:24 am


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General Food Topics • Re: hi how do i get golden apples

August 31, 2017 DR1VENbyKNOWLEDGE 0

OK, first thing…

Go to the secret fairy in the Red Glen south of the troll bridge. Don’t forget to promise the troll a golden feather or he wont let you pass!!!

Then when the fairy queen appears in the Red Glen tickle her left toe with the “Everlasting Tickle Rod” you get at the beginning of the game from the fairy lord when he appears in the kings chamber.

The fairy queen will then transport you to the “Fields of Forever” and you’ll find the Golden apple orchards there.

Sleep there three days and there will be some Golden apples to harvest. Punch the trees 20 times to harvest them. Watch out for any that have the green Worms of Woe in them. Those ones are poisons.

This should work……. If it doesn’t, try going to a gaming website instead of a preppers forum. You might have better luck there. :rofl:

Happy elf smashing…
~D

Statistics: Posted by DR1VENbyKNOWLEDGE — Thu Aug 31, 2017 9:24 am


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General Food Topics • Re: Store fruitcake

August 16, 2017 broden 0

my Mom would always make fruit cakes around the holidays. my Dad would always take one and store it in liquor for many months and then finally eat it, rationing it out a bit so it would last longer.

Statistics: Posted by broden — Tue Aug 15, 2017 7:38 pm


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General Food Topics • Re: Store fruitcake

August 16, 2017 broden 0

my Mom would always make fruit cakes around the holidays. my Dad would always take one and store it in liquor for many months and then finally eat it, rationing it out a bit so it would last longer.

Statistics: Posted by broden — Tue Aug 15, 2017 7:38 pm


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General Food Topics • Re: Store fruitcake

August 15, 2017 sageprice 0

fresh fruitcake isn’t very good until it has been soaked with brandy or rum or both. It should sit for at least three months. Traditionally, fruit cake was made during the Autumn harvest when fruit was plentiful. Aging fruitcake greatly improves it’s flavor. Unfortunately most commercial fruitcakes are poorly lacking in flavor and aroma due to their quick to market approach.

Statistics: Posted by sageprice — Tue Aug 15, 2017 1:35 pm


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General Food Topics • Re: Store fruitcake

August 15, 2017 sageprice 0

fresh fruitcake isn’t very good until it has been soaked with brandy or rum or both. It should sit for at least three months. Traditionally, fruit cake was made during the Autumn harvest when fruit was plentiful. Aging fruitcake greatly improves it’s flavor. Unfortunately most commercial fruitcakes are poorly lacking in flavor and aroma due to their quick to market approach.

Statistics: Posted by sageprice — Tue Aug 15, 2017 1:35 pm


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General Food Topics • Re: Store fruitcake

August 15, 2017 ReadyMom 0

I’m English. I *LOVE* fruitcake!! My mom would make a fruitcake for every Christmas. And it was the BEST! Moist. Fruity. Full of liquor. Covered in Almond paste and Royal icing. Yummmmm! It would last a long time … if we didn’t eat it all!

When I got married, my mom made me a fruitcake for our wedding cake, at home. Decorated it with the silver beads & wedding ornaments that are traditional, in England. I’m so sad, because she wasn’t the kind of mom who encouraged you to help her in the kitchen or teach you how to do things. Everything I know how to do, I’ve had to teach myself. So … I never learned how to make that yummy fruitcake. And the tattered, yellowed Bistro cookbook that she brought with her,from England to use for her recipe, has disappeared (I think my SIL has it :( ).

When I went to England, on a trip with our soccer playing son … one of the first things I bought was a piece of REAL English fruitcake to eat on the way to the hotel. The stuff you get in America that is called ‘fruitcake’ is awful. Fruitcake has gotten a bad rap here. 🙁

Statistics: Posted by ReadyMom — Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:17 am


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General Food Topics • Re: Store fruitcake

August 15, 2017 ReadyMom 0

I’m English. I *LOVE* fruitcake!! My mom would make a fruitcake for every Christmas. And it was the BEST! Moist. Fruity. Full of liquor. Covered in Almond paste and Royal icing. Yummmmm! It would last a long time … if we didn’t eat it all!

When I got married, my mom made me a fruitcake for our wedding cake, at home. Decorated it with the silver beads & wedding ornaments that are traditional, in England. I’m so sad, because she wasn’t the kind of mom who encouraged you to help her in the kitchen or teach you how to do things. Everything I know how to do, I’ve had to teach myself. So … I never learned how to make that yummy fruitcake. And the tattered, yellowed Bistro cookbook that she brought with her,from England to use for her recipe, has disappeared (I think my SIL has it :( ).

When I went to England, on a trip with our soccer playing son … one of the first things I bought was a piece of REAL English fruitcake to eat on the way to the hotel. The stuff you get in America that is called ‘fruitcake’ is awful. Fruitcake has gotten a bad rap here. 🙁

Statistics: Posted by ReadyMom — Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:17 am


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General Food Topics • Re: Store fruitcake

August 15, 2017 Genevieve 0

I saw a recipe for fruit cake that was a century old. It had none of the crap that goes into one now-a-days. It was a basic cake with dried cherries,currants,blueberries and raisins. Then it was drenched in brandy or rum.
I’m thinking the liquor helped preserve it lol

It sounds good though

Statistics: Posted by Genevieve — Tue Aug 15, 2017 5:40 am


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General Food Topics • Re: Store fruitcake

August 15, 2017 Genevieve 0

I saw a recipe for fruit cake that was a century old. It had none of the crap that goes into one now-a-days. It was a basic cake with dried cherries,currants,blueberries and raisins. Then it was drenched in brandy or rum.
I’m thinking the liquor helped preserve it lol

It sounds good though

Statistics: Posted by Genevieve — Tue Aug 15, 2017 5:40 am


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General Food Topics • Re: Store fruitcake

August 14, 2017 dmwalsh568 0

I suspect it lasted that long because it was basically in a freezer all that time based on where it was found….

For those if us living outside the artic we need to take more active steps to preserve fruitcake. Decent article about that covers shelf life extension of fruitcake:

https://whatscookingamerica.net/Q-A/fruitcakesec.htm

That said, I’m not planning on storing fruitcake at all, let alone long term. Store what you eat and all that… :evil:

Statistics: Posted by dmwalsh568 — Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:19 pm


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General Food Topics • Re: Store fruitcake

August 14, 2017 dmwalsh568 0

I suspect it lasted that long because it was basically in a freezer all that time based on where it was found….

For those if us living outside the artic we need to take more active steps to preserve fruitcake. Decent article about that covers shelf life extension of fruitcake:

https://whatscookingamerica.net/Q-A/fruitcakesec.htm

That said, I’m not planning on storing fruitcake at all, let alone long term. Store what you eat and all that… :evil:

Statistics: Posted by dmwalsh568 — Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:19 pm


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General Food Topics • Re: Store fruitcake

August 14, 2017 dmwalsh568 0

I suspect it lasted that long because it was basically in a freezer all that time based on where it was found….

For those if us living outside the artic we need to take more active steps to preserve fruitcake. Decent article about that covers shelf life extension of fruitcake:

https://whatscookingamerica.net/Q-A/fruitcakesec.htm

That said, I’m not planning on storing fruitcake at all, let alone long term. Store what you eat and all that… :evil:

Statistics: Posted by dmwalsh568 — Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:19 pm


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General Food Topics • Store fruitcake

August 14, 2017 broden 0
Researchers Find 100-Year-Old Antarctic Fruitcake in ‘Excellent Condition’

http://mentalfloss.com/article/503553/r … -condition

If you want a snack that really won’t go bad, consider the fruitcake. Conservationists working with artifacts from Cape Adare, Antarctica, just discovered a remarkably well-preserved fruitcake dating back a full century, according to Gizmodo.

follow above link for full article

Statistics: Posted by broden — Mon Aug 14, 2017 1:59 pm


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General Food Topics • Store fruitcake

August 14, 2017 broden 0
Researchers Find 100-Year-Old Antarctic Fruitcake in ‘Excellent Condition’

http://mentalfloss.com/article/503553/r … -condition

If you want a snack that really won’t go bad, consider the fruitcake. Conservationists working with artifacts from Cape Adare, Antarctica, just discovered a remarkably well-preserved fruitcake dating back a full century, according to Gizmodo.

follow above link for full article

Statistics: Posted by broden — Mon Aug 14, 2017 1:59 pm


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General Food Topics • Store fruitcake

August 14, 2017 broden 0
Researchers Find 100-Year-Old Antarctic Fruitcake in ‘Excellent Condition’

http://mentalfloss.com/article/503553/r … -condition

If you want a snack that really won’t go bad, consider the fruitcake. Conservationists working with artifacts from Cape Adare, Antarctica, just discovered a remarkably well-preserved fruitcake dating back a full century, according to Gizmodo.

follow above link for full article

Statistics: Posted by broden — Mon Aug 14, 2017 1:59 pm


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General Food Topics • Store fruitcake

August 14, 2017 broden 0
Researchers Find 100-Year-Old Antarctic Fruitcake in ‘Excellent Condition’

http://mentalfloss.com/article/503553/r … -condition

If you want a snack that really won’t go bad, consider the fruitcake. Conservationists working with artifacts from Cape Adare, Antarctica, just discovered a remarkably well-preserved fruitcake dating back a full century, according to Gizmodo.

follow above link for full article

Statistics: Posted by broden — Mon Aug 14, 2017 1:59 pm


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General Food Topics • Re: Electric vs Gas Operated Stoves and Ovens

August 13, 2017 PatrioticStabilist 0

We have 2 100 pound tanks will run my kitchen stove for about a year, I love to cook with
propane. We also have an old wood stove at MIL’s we could use if we needed to and there is plenty
of wood to be had here. Likely have to install it to heat the house and cook also, but it would
work. Wonder if we should buy and stock up on new stove pipes and damper just in case.

We have 3 generators both gas and diesel but may not be able to get more fuel for them after
awhile. Will have to run them off and on for refrigeration. With no central heating system
eventually basement would be cool enough to keep a lot of foods.

Statistics: Posted by PatrioticStabilist — Sun Aug 13, 2017 1:36 am


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General Food Topics • Re: Electric vs Gas Operated Stoves and Ovens

August 13, 2017 PatrioticStabilist 0

We have 2 100 pound tanks will run my kitchen stove for about a year, I love to cook with
propane. We also have an old wood stove at MIL’s we could use if we needed to and there is plenty
of wood to be had here. Likely have to install it to heat the house and cook also, but it would
work. Wonder if we should buy and stock up on new stove pipes and damper just in case.

We have 3 generators both gas and diesel but may not be able to get more fuel for them after
awhile. Will have to run them off and on for refrigeration. With no central heating system
eventually basement would be cool enough to keep a lot of foods.

Statistics: Posted by PatrioticStabilist — Sun Aug 13, 2017 1:36 am