No Picture

Vacuum Sealing • Re: Oxygen absorbers vs chamber vacuuming.

March 18, 2017 Murby 0
FiatCurrency_1913 wrote:
Dear people,

I’m only a novice when it comes to prepping, but I noticed almost all of you use oxygen absorbers with mylar bags (or mason jars with a vacuum mouth device) to store dry foods. I happend to have a professional chamber vacuum machine and when I vacuum dry foods, like rice, wheat or beans in mylar bags, it becomes hard like a rock and you can reach up to 99.8% vacuum inside the mylar bag. My question is: does this also happen with oxygen absorbers added to a nearly sealed mylar bag? Or is the achieved vacuum much less this way? Thx!

I also use a profession level vacuum.. not a chamber however, but a rotary vane evacuation pump for refrigeration systems.. My vacuum reaches north of 29 inHg which is far far better than any foodsaver can do…

When we vacuum pack Mylar bags, we shove in an O2 absorber, then apply heavy vacuum.. You could clobber someone in the head and kill them with a Mylar bag of rice.. its as hard as a rock.

Be careful with foods that have pointy or sharp edges though.. they can poke holes in the mylar. When we do pasta, we pre-pack the pasta in ziplock freezer bags (but don’t zip lock them).. this protects the Mylar pretty well..

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sat Mar 18, 2017 1:46 pm


No Picture

A.N.T.S. • Re: Online data collection and privacy

March 17, 2017 Murby 0

It would seem that some folks don’t understand how 256 bit AES data encryption works.

If I gave the NSA, the CIA, and the FBI a 512 bit AES encrypted file, the best computers on the planet would take longer than the age of the universe to crack it.

The problem isn’t the encryption, its fact that no one does it.

As I was saying.. I’m immune to broad net surveillance.. They would have to generate a specific interest in me and then expend considerable resources to that end.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Thu Mar 16, 2017 8:30 pm


No Picture

A.N.T.S. • Re: Online data collection and privacy

March 16, 2017 Murby 0
dmwalsh568 wrote:
Murby, you’re forgetting a 3rd easier way for them to track you through a VPN. Malware. If they can get malware onto your machine, then it will track your usage and whatever else it’s designed to hoover up (yes, an intentional pun) and then report back to the 3 letter agency that considers you a person of interest. Unless you run extra tight network security you’d never see the data leaving your device with all the details they could ever want….most folks just firewall incoming connections, not outgoing too.

I agree..

They have to get the malware into my machine first.. I run firefox with Noscript and AdblockPlus and do not click on every cute puppy picture that I am presented with. I run antivirus, hardware firewall, and software firewall..

I’m pretty sure the government has smarter people than I so I’m pretty sure they could still track me if they targeted me specifically.. If they tag you as a domestic terrorist, you can bet your rear end they’ll figure out a way to track you… This is not something I’m concerned with…

Maybe its a good thing I’m not a terrorist?? LOL..

The reality is that I’m more concerned with opportunistic tracking. If I download a video one day that documents how to turn a ball point pen into an intercontinental ballistic torpedo because I’m worried that mermaids might invade, I don’t want them logging all the IP addresses and then using that information to choose to track me to see what else I’ve been looking at.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:33 pm


No Picture

General Family Preparedness • Re: Libs Catch the Prepping Bug

March 14, 2017 Murby 0
IceFire wrote:
Murby, you’re a liberal on SOME issues, and a conservative on others…sounds to me more like you’re an INDEPENDENT than either strictly liberal or conservative!

Yes.. and I’m in a constant state of flux too! Sometimes people bring up facets of arguments that I haven’t considered before and it forces me to re-evaluate my position..

Unfortunately, my way (ideas) doesn’t always seem to be the best or only way to skin the proverbial cat.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Tue Mar 14, 2017 11:58 am


No Picture

General Family Preparedness • Re: Libs Catch the Prepping Bug

March 14, 2017 Murby 0
IceFire wrote:
Murby, you’re a liberal on SOME issues, and a conservative on others…sounds to me more like you’re an INDEPENDENT than either strictly liberal or conservative!

Yes.. and I’m in a constant state of flux too! Sometimes people bring up facets of arguments that I haven’t considered before and it forces me to re-evaluate my position..

Unfortunately, my way (ideas) doesn’t always seem to be the best or only way to skin the proverbial cat.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Tue Mar 14, 2017 11:58 am


No Picture

General Family Preparedness • Re: Libs Catch the Prepping Bug

March 14, 2017 Murby 0
Gunns wrote:
Well let me poke you in the eye with a stick then. LOL

Poke away! I don’t mind. I’m not always right, but I think it would be wise if we kept this light as these kinds of conversations can go south fast when some folks get overly emotional about the subjects.

I have no problems with Gays either. Just don’t think every TV show, Movie and now Disney remakes have to have same sex making out on them. For a small minority the queer Hollywood producers and writers are pushing it in our faces. That will backfire when SHTF.

I’m not a fan of being force-fed idea’s either.. Regardless of the merits of those ideas, when I turn on entertainment, I want to be entertained, not brainwashed..

As far as socialized health care that is for Socialist thinkers and drug testing is a violation of our Constitutional rights. Can’t see how someone says they base their decisions on science and math can be against the very principles of our Constitution. I can’t find it in the Constitution that says we need to socialize anything.

We already have socialization.. We all pay for infrastructure like roads and bridges, military, and even science like NASA..
Our society needs to be healthy to survive, it also needs to be educated in order to compete with others. Free-market is the best system in the world when it comes to marketplace trade based on elective purchasing (things you want but don’t require) but it fails when it comes to things you must have to prosper.. The conversation becomes convoluted when we consider the wide gray area between what is elective and what is required. Do you need medical care to survive? Of course you do.. But how much? Do you need an Xbox or fishing boat? Of course not.
Could you tell a person with a shattered leg that you’re not going to treat them if they can’t afford to pay you? I think most people would say no to that. So where does the money come from when you spend $20,000 to repair that persons leg? Currently, the hospitals just pass it on to those who have the money.. This is why an aspirin in a hospital cost north of $8 and they even charge you a buck for the paper cup it comes in.
I’m no expert, but it seems to me that such a system is even worse than any conceived notion of what socialized healthcare would or wouldn’t be.

As far as drug testing welfare recipients.. If they’re excepting public welfare, I think that gives us a right to make sure they’re not wasting the money on drugs, in fact, I don’t think welfare dollars should be allowed to be spent on any junk food either. I’m not sure how that is unconstitutional as you say but I’m all ears if you care to explain it to me.. I’m certainly no expert on the constitution or law.

As “Bones” would say.. “Damn It Jim, I’m an Engineer not a Lawyer!”

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Tue Mar 14, 2017 11:56 am


No Picture

General Family Preparedness • Re: Libs Catch the Prepping Bug

March 14, 2017 Murby 0
Gunns wrote:
Well let me poke you in the eye with a stick then. LOL

Poke away! I don’t mind. I’m not always right, but I think it would be wise if we kept this light as these kinds of conversations can go south fast when some folks get overly emotional about the subjects.

I have no problems with Gays either. Just don’t think every TV show, Movie and now Disney remakes have to have same sex making out on them. For a small minority the queer Hollywood producers and writers are pushing it in our faces. That will backfire when SHTF.

I’m not a fan of being force-fed idea’s either.. Regardless of the merits of those ideas, when I turn on entertainment, I want to be entertained, not brainwashed..

As far as socialized health care that is for Socialist thinkers and drug testing is a violation of our Constitutional rights. Can’t see how someone says they base their decisions on science and math can be against the very principles of our Constitution. I can’t find it in the Constitution that says we need to socialize anything.

We already have socialization.. We all pay for infrastructure like roads and bridges, military, and even science like NASA..
Our society needs to be healthy to survive, it also needs to be educated in order to compete with others. Free-market is the best system in the world when it comes to marketplace trade based on elective purchasing (things you want but don’t require) but it fails when it comes to things you must have to prosper.. The conversation becomes convoluted when we consider the wide gray area between what is elective and what is required. Do you need medical care to survive? Of course you do.. But how much? Do you need an Xbox or fishing boat? Of course not.
Could you tell a person with a shattered leg that you’re not going to treat them if they can’t afford to pay you? I think most people would say no to that. So where does the money come from when you spend $20,000 to repair that persons leg? Currently, the hospitals just pass it on to those who have the money.. This is why an aspirin in a hospital cost north of $8 and they even charge you a buck for the paper cup it comes in.
I’m no expert, but it seems to me that such a system is even worse than any conceived notion of what socialized healthcare would or wouldn’t be.

As far as drug testing welfare recipients.. If they’re excepting public welfare, I think that gives us a right to make sure they’re not wasting the money on drugs, in fact, I don’t think welfare dollars should be allowed to be spent on any junk food either. I’m not sure how that is unconstitutional as you say but I’m all ears if you care to explain it to me.. I’m certainly no expert on the constitution or law.

As “Bones” would say.. “Damn It Jim, I’m an Engineer not a Lawyer!”

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Tue Mar 14, 2017 11:56 am


No Picture

General Family Preparedness • Re: Libs Catch the Prepping Bug

March 13, 2017 Murby 0

Just for the record, I would be considered a progressive liberal.. But I think I’m a special rare flavor..

Gays are fine with me, I think we should socialize our healthcare, and I believe in a lot of other liberal attributes.

I also think we should have mandatory drug testing for welfare and anyone accused of attempting to attenuate a private citizens right to own firearms should be banned from all public service.

Perhaps the difference its that every decision or opinion I form is based on science and math, not on a feel-good mentality. From how I treat my child, to how I pay my bills, to how and why I prep for a disaster, it is all based on sound science and only science..

I think the problem in the divide between liberals and conservatives is that most of them base their opinions on other opinions.. most of them do not rationalize their opinions based on real information.

Too many people fail in critical thinking skills and let their feelings run their lives.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Mon Mar 13, 2017 11:42 am


No Picture

Food & Water • Ghee???

March 13, 2017 Murby 0

Anyone? Opinions?

Its called “Clarified Butter” and has a ridiculously long shelf life..

Does it really taste like butter?

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sun Mar 12, 2017 8:20 pm


No Picture

Food & Water • Ghee???

March 13, 2017 Murby 0

Anyone? Opinions?

Its called “Clarified Butter” and has a ridiculously long shelf life..

Does it really taste like butter?

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sun Mar 12, 2017 8:20 pm


No Picture

A.N.T.S. • Re: Online data collection and privacy

March 11, 2017 Murby 0
rickdun wrote:
Murby, that’s the legal way of doing things, we are not living in a legal society anymore, you may want to direct your question to the CIA, NSA, DNI, etc. and see what kind of response you get from them.

There’s no technical way that I am aware of for the government to track my movements going through a VPN without the VPN knowing about it and allowing it. They could track me through my ISP, but all they’d see is a bunch of heavily encrypted data that would require time on a super-computer in order to crack. Good luck with that…

So this would reduce the variables to just two:
A) They serve a warrant on the vpn ordering them to hand over the data for me specifically. As I was saying, they could still track my internet activities if they targeted me specifically but even their warrant would be nearly useless as my VPN and its encryption are external to the USA and thus not subject to any warrants. The NSA, and probably the NSA alone, probably has the computing power to intercept my encrypted traffic through my ISP and decrypt it.. that said, we’re not talking about a geek like me with a good computer doing this.. This type of thing would take a significant amount of resources, as in the kind of resources that tie up expensive super-computers.. And again, they’d have to target me specifically..

B) The VPN service I use is complicit and volunteers the information.. I seriously doubt they would do this as it would put them out of business in a big hurry once word got out. In fact, to my knowledge, no VPN service has ever done this or even been accused of doing it. That would be on par with a gynecologist being accused of taking pictures of patients and posting them on the internet.. Who would visit that doctor after that?.. All of the government spying that has taken place has happened through the telecommunications companies like Verizon, Comcast, etc and all of the surveillance (again to my knowledge), was low level data collection using a big wide fishing net. Anyone with an ounce of technical common sense and concern for their privacy could have easily avoided being swept up in it.. IE: those of us who use heavily encrypted VPN services with IP addresses that change on an hourly basis.

daaswampman wrote:
How would you know if a VPN has been served a warrant or not, unless your the top dog? Even a small and secure VPN or any variant crosses the net, so a warrant may be pointless. The recent “cloud’ issues makes it more pointless. I sure don’t have answers, but if you want to keep a secret – you don’t tell anyone. Swamp

My VPN is not subject to the laws of the USA even though they have servers here.. The encryption is still external. I also never do anything with “the cloud”.

The point being, as I was saying earlier, if they want to track ME specifically, they’re going to have to devote considerable resources.. Funny thing is, they wouldn’t find anything anyhow.. Some interest in prepping for the end of the world, a few minor political comments, a bit of lesbian porn, an anti-religious rant here or there, and a few searches to find cheap 22lr ammo.. Not exactly juicy stuff for a law enforcement agency.

So one might ask.. Then why use a VPN at all if you’re not doing anything wrong???? Here are my personal reasons in no important order:
1. ISP’s are known for “throttling” their users bandwidth based on the website they are visiting. If you visit youtube, they might slow your connection down a bit to save themselves money. By going through a VPN, your ISP has no idea of where your data is going or where its coming from.. That means that profiling your data and throttling your connection based on that profile is impossible.

2. I don’t want corporations tracking my movements and then tailoring their services or products based on some psychological profile they have of me based on my internet habits.

3. I search for all kinds of things on the internet.. I even searched for information on how long it takes for a child to die in a hot car because I was curious as to how parents make these mistakes when I see the stories in the news. What if I searched for this information and then a month or two later, it happened to me? A prosecution could use that information against me and claim I planned it all along. (Ya, I just made that up because I saw a similar thing happen in the news a few months back) My point being, “Anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law”.. and your internet activities are fair game. By using a VPN, and proper computer management and drive encryption, I can avoid all those worries.

4. (and this one is a bit embarrassing but I’m going to be honest about it) Occasionally, usually in the winter months when I’m bored, I find it fun to infiltrate websites that cater to really bad people..and then troll a bit for fun.. You know the types.. the KKK, the White Pride, and the religious wacko websites… Sometimes its fun to poke them with a stick and get a rise.. Of course, this results in being banned pretty quickly but its still fun.. Using a VPN allows me to change my IP address anytime I want and gives me the option of just using a different username.

VPN’s are great! I find it silly that everyone doesn’t use them…

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sat Mar 11, 2017 12:46 am


A.N.T.S. • Re: Online data collection and privacy

March 10, 2017 Murby 0
rickdun wrote:
The government tracks by IP address, all computers, smart phones, iphones, etc., are all registered and tracked by GPS. The government may not know who you are but they know where you are.

And how would they track me through a VPN without serving a warrant on the VPN?

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Fri Mar 10, 2017 5:50 pm


No Picture

A.N.T.S. • Re: Online data collection and privacy

March 10, 2017 Murby 0
rickdun wrote:
The government tracks by IP address, all computers, smart phones, iphones, etc., are all registered and tracked by GPS. The government may not know who you are but they know where you are.

And how would they track me through a VPN without serving a warrant on the VPN?

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Fri Mar 10, 2017 5:50 pm


A.N.T.S. • Re: Online data collection and privacy

March 10, 2017 Murby 0

I think:

1. I don’t put any information on facebook or any other social networking sites.
2. I never use my real name anywhere unless I’m making a credit card purchase.
3. I use firefox with NoScript, DoNotTrackme, and Cookie Selfdestructor so I have control over what websites can and can’t do.

And above all else:
I use a Virtual Private Network service that states in writing they DO NOT keep logs or records and that allows me to change my VPN Location on a whim. =$30/year for the service.

With all that, the government could still track me but it would have to do so intentionally and target me specifically, and for that, they’d need a court order..

That said, I don’t protect myself because of the government.. I don’t do anything that would warrant their attention.. (get it? warrant! LOL) I crack myself up! hehehe.. I keep myself private to prevent the corporations from taking advantage of me.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Thu Mar 09, 2017 10:01 pm


No Picture

Terrorism & other Man made disasters • Re: Congress told to brace for ‘robotic soldiers’

March 5, 2017 Murby 0
RockinB wrote:
Those google / amazon gadgets seem like a massive intrusion into the lives of anyone around them. Always listening to every word spoken, just waiting to hear that certain buzz word that “turns on the light”. I wonder how many other buzz words it’s waiting for that doesn’t turn on the light.

My tinfoil Stetson may be a little tight but I think I’ll be staying away from SkyNet as long as possible….

That was freaking funny as hell!

+1

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sun Mar 05, 2017 12:09 am


No Picture

General Preparedness Discussion • Re: MARCH 2017 – What Did You do To Prep This Week/Month?

March 4, 2017 Murby 0
rickdun wrote:
Slowly eliminating caned meat and getting freezedried, have 4 cases of chicken and 4 cases of beef now, I’ve been ordering a case of each, each month until I get 10 cases of each total. I’ve priced various companies and I’ve been ordering mine from Honeyville.

.

Really? You like the freeze dried meat better than pressure canned or store bought?

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sat Mar 04, 2017 2:59 pm


No Picture

Terrorism & other Man made disasters • Re: Congress told to brace for ‘robotic soldiers’

March 2, 2017 Murby 0

The problem with robotic soldiers isn’t software, its energy…

Until battery energy storage densities get much much better, a robotic soldier isn’t going to be very effective.

They already tried a robotic pack mule in Afghanistan.. A “dog like” robot that could carry 100 lbs of supplies and would follow the soldiers wherever they go. No battery can provide that much juice so they installed a small chain-saw type of motor in it.. The soldiers complained it gave away their position because it was so noisy.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Thu Mar 02, 2017 4:45 pm


No Picture

General Food Topics • Re: PREP TEST: DAIRY & Eggs-Freeze Dried & Dehydrated Produc

March 2, 2017 Murby 0

Wow.. this thread was SOOOOO unexpected.

I absolutely love eggs.. we have (had) chickens I would eat 30 eggs per week in all forums from sunny-side-up to scrambled to french toast.. Next to Alaskan King Crab, eggs are one of my favorite foods.

So a while back, I did some engineering work for a factory that just happens to produce… wait for it! Powdered eggs! So I called up the plant manager and asked him if he could send me a box of them.. We didn’t discuss much.. I’m thinking I’m going to get a plastic bag in a shoe box full of egg powder right? Wrong! A week later, a 30ft box truck pulls up to my house with one of those lift gates.. The guy rolls off a pallet filled with 16 inch square boxes and I’m like “umm.. think you have the wrong address buddy”.. Nope.. turns out the plant manager sent me 500 lbs worth of powdered eggs. (they must have been real happy with the work I did for them! LOL)

So anyhow.. I tried them and I loved them! But one thing I did learn is that you have to mix them with water correctly… You can’t just “eyeball it”.. its not hot chocolate.. not enough water and they taste to thick like cardboard… too much water and they don’t reconstitute correctly.. But when we followed the directions, I couldn’t really tell the difference between fresh eggs and powdered eggs.

Not sure what the problem with your eggs is but mine are fine..

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Thu Mar 02, 2017 10:54 am


:offtopic:

Livestock and more • Re: Meat Grinders

March 2, 2017 Murby 0

I have a 1hp Cabela’s meat grinder.. It chews through venison and pork as fast as I can shove it in. Doesn’t matter if its frozen or thawed, new or aged..

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Wed Mar 01, 2017 9:23 pm


No Picture

Terrorism & other Man made disasters • Re: EMPs (Electro Magnetic Pulse)

March 1, 2017 Murby 0
ReadyMom wrote:

Murby wrote:
A metal trash can is fine but you should tape shut the gap where the lid connects to the can with a conductive tape.. It might feel tight but it probably isn’t. A high frequency, high amplitude pulse from a HEMP or NEMP can penetrate a weak seam where the lid connects to the can.. My preliminary list to put in it:

I have the silver aluminum tape for the lid/can seal. Will that work? -k

I don’t know.. I would suggest the manufacturers website to see if both sides are conductive. You could probably wrap it with tinfoil and then tape that too.. Just get a good seal.. no gaps, no openings.. not even small gaps.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Wed Mar 01, 2017 2:48 pm


No Picture

Terrorism & other Man made disasters • Re: EMPs (Electro Magnetic Pulse)

March 1, 2017 Murby 0
ReadyMom wrote:
Murby THANK YOU so much for your reply! I appreciate your noting your background, so I can feel comfortable relying on your information. There are so many folks who just throw info out on the forum, without anything to back it up and when prepping you just can NOT rely on all info to be tried & true. Links & educations/occupational backgrounds are best when sharing info.

I like the way you explained how to make the faraday cage. I made one out of a brand new metal trash can … it’s what I could get and it fits in my house. I lined the sides & bottom with card board and it has a VERY tight lid. I wrap my products in brown paper and then put them in tin-foil. From your explanation I should also be purchasing the static bags. Question: Is this all for naught, because it’s a metal trash can vs a steel drum?

I’d also like you input on our list of things to include in a faraday cage. Are some of the things included not necessary (it would free up space, if they don’t need to be there) … I’m thinking batteries, for instance.

Thanks again! -k

A metal trash can is fine but you should tape shut the gap where the lid connects to the can with a conductive tape.. It might feel tight but it probably isn’t. A high frequency, high amplitude pulse from a HEMP or NEMP can penetrate a weak seam where the lid connects to the can.. My preliminary list to put in it:

Jewelers Scale – needed to weigh out things like chemicals and possibly gold or silver for trade.

Radio – CB Radio, Ham Radio for communications.

LED CHIPS – I buy LED chips that I mount to heat sinks myself to make my own led lights. But any LED or compact fluorescent light will be destroyed by an EMP so if you want light afterwards, your choices will be either incandescent (which won’t be affected if not turned on) or LED chips.

Laptop w/dvd player – Entertainment and I have libraries of information on DVD that allow me to reference materials on chemistry, engineering, steam, biology, medicine, drugs, etc.

Battery Charger – I gave up on Alkaline batteries.. We buy Eneloop or Energizer rechargeable for everything now. You need an extra charger and it needs to be protected from EMP. NOTE: Batteries do NOT need to be protected, just the chargers. The only batteries that need protection are those which have built-in circuits designed right into the battery. I know that there are some lithium Ion batters designed for cordless power tools that fall under this category, but other than that, batteries are not damaged by EMP.

MultiMeter – That would be the electrical guy in me.. A multimeter would let me work to repair things.

Calculator – Always handy.

DC-AC Inverter – Useful for running AC appliances from a DC battery. Inverters have microelectronics in them and will be fried in an EMP so keep one, or several in your Faraday cage.

pH meter – Knowing the pH of various things will greatly help. From planting seedlings and knowing if the dirt is good, to mixing chemicals.

Digital Food Thermometer – Since you’ll be cooking on an old fashioned wood fire, you’ll need a way to check the internal temperature of your meat products. Get one that uses your rechargeable batteries.

I’m not diabetic, but if anyone is, you’ll want an extra blood tester stored.

Solar Panels – Most large solar panels will not fit in a 55 gallon drum so you’ll need to figure out some other way to store them. You could buy a small 30 watt panel just for charging batteries and store that. Perhaps store a couple of them.

Well, that’s a start.. I don’t think I forgot anything..

I should also note that I only prep for EMP.. I live in Michigan and nothing ever happens here.. We don’t get biblical floods, hurricanes or earth quakes.. and we have 1/5 of the worlds fresh water supply.. So with that in mind, my only concern is a solar emp (We just missed a major Carrington level event by only 9 days back in 2012) or a nuclear attack.

I do not prep for viral apocalypse because I don’t think it will ever happen or even could happen. We simply prep for a long duration (>1 year) without grid power or electronics.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Wed Mar 01, 2017 1:48 pm


No Picture

Terrorism & other Man made disasters • Re: EMPs (Electro Magnetic Pulse)

March 1, 2017 Murby 0
ReadyMom wrote:
First of all Murby, I can’t help but take offense to the way you answered my question. It was kind of snarky. I have NO idea what your background is, and it was an honest question, because there’s so much info ‘out there’ and I wanted to know why you were making those suggestions.

My apologies.. I can come off snarky when I type.. not meant that way.

Next … YES … I would like to have an answer in ‘laymen’s terms’. Your offer to give such an explanation leads me to think you may have a background in this topic and help would be much appreciated to understand the best way to TRY to protect SOME electronic-type items that could use alternate power sources.

I’m an electrical engineer.. although truth be told I don’t do much of that kind of work… most of what I do is process engineering.. but ya, my education does provide me with quite a bit of insight into this kind of thing.

And finally …. I see that you already have offered some explanation a few posts later. The explanation is much appreciated. Given what you have written I see you have a faraday cage at home. (I searched through some of your older posts 8) to see what else you may have offered in other threads on this topic. I was also curious to see if you mentioned a background in this field or if it was just a well researched topic, on your behalf ) What type of faraday cage have you made that you are feeling comfortable relying on? -k

I have both a background in electrical subjects and have done a lot of research. Electromagnetic wave propagation is a field in itself, especially the high energy fast pulses.

Find yourself an open top metal 55 gallon drum.. the kind that have the removable lid and clamp ring. 55 gallon drums are made of 18 and 20 gauge steel and offer a great first layer protection against the E1 pulse that is generated by a Nuclear detonation in space. Wash the drum out with soap and water, dry it up really good and if its bare steel, paint it with an oil based paint for metal (inside and out but not the part where the drum and lid connect) .. (rustoleum is good)… Let it dry completely.. (usually takes a week in hot sun).. Then get some cardboard or other non-conductive sheeting material (at least 1/4 inch thick) and completely line the inside of the drum with it.. (double layer cardboard is fine) A hot glue gun works good to make the cardboard stick to the inside of the metal drum. The cardboard acts as an insulator because the individual (conductive) layers of your Faraday cage can not come into contact with each other.

Get the top of the drum and remove the foam rubber seal around the inside of the lip.. Make sure there is no paint (bare metal only) where the drum contacts the lid.. It is critically important that this metal to metal connection be tight.. even rust is bad.. you want the metal lid to be connected to the metal drum. The better the metal to metal connection, the better it will seal against EMP. You could even go one step further and install a bonding strap between the drum and the lid, but even with that, you want that lid tight on the drum.

The clamp ring that secures the lid to the drum should (ideally) be sandblasted clean and spray painted with a conductive paint.. Those rings are usually coated with some kind of powder coating or other protective surface finish and that’s bad because it acts as an insulator and you don’t want that.

Once your drum is all spiffy, clean, and lined with cardboard, you want to put your delicate electronics into static shielding bags. What is a static shielding bag? If you’ve ever ordered a computer hard drive, computer memory, or some other kind of computer part, you may have noticed they came wrapped in a plastic-metallic foil bag that looked and felt sort of like a Mylar bag. These are static shield bags and they come in a variety of quality levels. Put your electronics in these bags and tape the bag shut after folding it over on itself. Then put that bag into another (bigger?) bag to make a bag-in-bag.

Place into the drum, close it up tight, and you have a very nice Faraday cage. DO NOT ground the drum.. If you ground the drum incorrectly, you’re more likely to create an EMP antenna to amplify the effect rather than shield from it.

If you are handy, and you want to go the extra mile, you can get some thin aluminum and add another layer on the inside of the drum so that the cardboard is between the metal drum and the 2nd layer.. Make sure the second layer has its own lid and that the second layer of metal has no contact with the drum itself. You’ll want to put cardboard inside that second layer also.

A metal ammo can placed inside the drum would also act as a second layer.. then put a plastic bag in that and add your pre-wrapped electronics into that. The idea is that the more conductive layers, the better the shielding attenuation of the pulse.

Multiple thin layers are better than a single thicker layer..
Mutiple materials are better than a single material. For instance, a cage made of three layers of steel would not be as good as a cage made of three layers where each layer is a different metal.. (Steel, aluminum, copper)

A single layer metal 55 gallon drum with individually wrapped electronics inside their own static bags, is probably enough to protect 95% of electronics, 95% of the time (or more)…

There’s actually a guy from NASA who has a PhD in electrical engineering who specializes in this field.. I think his name is Bradley something.. He’s also a prepper and does a great job of explaining this..

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Wed Mar 01, 2017 1:10 am


No Picture

Terrorism & other Man made disasters • Re: EMPs (Electro Magnetic Pulse)

February 28, 2017 Murby 0
NJMike wrote:
Murby,

I’m curious on this:

It should be noted that putting electronics in a Faraday cage for a solar storm is a waste of time.

Is this due to the duration of a massive solar storm and someone taking their electronics out of the box prematurely?
OR
Is this due to construction/materials of the Faraday cage vs. shorter wavelengths’ penetration?
OR
Inducted energy within the Faraday Cage, or something else?

Also, Any difference if the Faraday Cage is non-screen and grounded?

Thanks.

Its because a Faraday cage just isn’t needed for an EMP caused by a Coronal Mass Ejection…. The induced voltages are too small to bother small electronic devices on the ground. In fact, solar EMP’s are sort of a mislabeled event and are kind of misleading in that regard. You have to have an understanding of the differences between a nuclear emp and a solar emp.

Nuclear EMP ( E1 pulse) is caused by gamma rays knocking electrons loose from the atoms in our atmosphere.. This is called “the Compton Effect” or “Compton Scattering”.. When those electrons get knocked loose, they travel to the ground and induce voltages up to 50,000 volts per meter into conductive surfaces. This all happens within time frames measured in nano-seconds.. There’s no real amperage behind it, its mostly a quick static like charge similar to what you get on a dry day when you kiss your wife and you zap each other. But that’s enough to absolutely fry delicate micro-electronics that our world runs on today. Anything not well protected behind multiple layers of emp shielding will be fried.. Well.. at least those things nearest the detonation center.. as the distance increases, the laws of wave propagation (inverse square to the distance) reduce the severity the further they are from the detonation point.. Eventually, the signal is too weak to do any damage to things. Within a 1000 mile radius, a metal trash can isn’t going to provide much protection without multiple layers.. outside that 1000 mile radius, the metal trashcan on its own might actually protect something.. but I wouldn’t count on it.

A solar EMP is a very different animal.. This is the (E3 pulse).. Solar EMP isn’t really an EMP pulse at all.. its more like a wave. When the billions of tons of particles streaming from the Sun hit our atmosphere, they compress the Earth’s magnetic field on the day side and cause a tail to form on the night side (It causes our magnetic field to move around).. When the stream of particles pass us, the magnetic field returns to normal. Its that simple.. but…..
What happens when you move a magnetic field around in the presence of a metal conductor? You get electrons flowing! This magnetically induced charge isn’t powerful or concentrated enough to have any meaningful affect on small conductors like electronics.. but those long power lines stretching across our country that carry electricity every where? Oh boy! Those act like giant antennas and the magnetic field induces a charge of about 1 volt per meter into those lines. Now, 1 volt per meter isn’t much considering your iPhone is only about 6 inches long.. your big screen TV certainly won’t be bothered by an extra volt within its circuits.. But a power line that runs hundreds of miles? That one volt per meter is going to add up fast! Transformers designed to take 14,000 volts will suddenly see the input voltage go past 100,000 or more.. causing huge voltage spikes, huge rushes of current, and very high conductor temperatures.

Anything connected to the power grid is likely to be fried when your normal household power goes from 240 volts (120 per side) to a whopping 10,000 volts (or more) and the current to back it up..

Your electronics that are not plugged into the grid are not in danger of being damaged by the EMP, they’re in danger of being burned by the fire as your home burns to the ground because your television or your microwave caught fire.

For Nuclear EMP, you get a Faraday cage..
For Solar EMP, you get fire extinguishers.

Either way, you might also want to get a steam engine because you won’t see any grid supplied electricity for several years…

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Tue Feb 28, 2017 5:05 pm


No Picture

Okie’s Law • Re: Protection from Rogue Officers

February 28, 2017 Murby 0

A criminal with a badge is still a criminal and shall be dealt with as such under a SHTF situation.

If we American’s simply give up our rights because we are afraid to die due to overwhelming force, then we’ve already lost everything. My philosophy is a life for a life.. I am willing to die to protect my rights and the rights of others.. The cops trying to confiscate my guns better be willing to die also because I’m going to get at least one them and I won’t be afraid to fire the first head shot.

When the rest of America takes on the same attitude, they won’t go door to door trying to intimidate people and violate their rights.

They count on the fact that you value your comfortable life with your iphone, xbox, television and fast food more than you value your freedom and your liberties…

Who said the famous phrase “Those who give up liberties for safety deserve neither” or something like that.

Most cops are good people.. and believe it or not, most political leaders have good intentions and are also good people.. even if they make stupid mistakes..

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Tue Feb 28, 2017 2:52 pm


No Picture

Terrorism & other Man made disasters • Re: EMPs (Electro Magnetic Pulse)

February 28, 2017 Murby 0
ReadyMom wrote:

Murby wrote:Like dressing in layers for cold weather, EMP Shielding is best accomplished using those same layers.

It should be noted that putting electronics in a Faraday cage for a solar storm is a waste of time.

But for a nuclear EMP, you want layers.. Use static bags, at least two layers, and then a metal can.

Can you provide links with confirmation for that suggestion. Thanks! -k

Harharhar hahaha.. Would you like a link to Northern Michigan University’s Electrical Engineering program? hehehehe..

If you tell me what your question is, I might be able to explain the how and why in layman’s terms.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Tue Feb 28, 2017 2:01 pm


No Picture

Terrorism & other Man made disasters • Re: EMPs (Electro Magnetic Pulse)

February 28, 2017 Murby 0

Like dressing in layers for cold weather, EMP Shielding is best accomplished using those same layers.

It should be noted that putting electronics in a Faraday cage for a solar storm is a waste of time.

But for a nuclear EMP, you want layers.. Use static bags, at least two layers, and then a metal can.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Tue Feb 28, 2017 11:37 am


No Picture

The Survival Mom Forum Discussions • Re: illegal to posess more than 7 days food!!!!!

February 27, 2017 Murby 0

I don’t think it matters if they have the resources to go door-to-door or not.. the fact that they are even trying to do it would cause me to consider them to be the enemy…

In a SHTF situation, if I hear of authorities roaming around and confiscating things, I’d shoot first and hopefully take out at least one of them before they took me out… If every citizen can take out just one of the gestapo, they don’t stand a chance..

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Mon Feb 27, 2017 10:02 am


No Picture

The Survival Mom Forum Discussions • Re: illegal to posess more than 7 days food!!!!!

February 26, 2017 Murby 0
bane5150 wrote:
IMO the government wants you to prep. In a disaster thats 1 household less they have to worry about…I know they watch these sites and IMO they are looking for the crazys that shouldnt own or possess weapons and so on.

Which is exactly why I route my IP address through VPN’s…

If you want my food, you’ll have to pry it from my cold dead hungry hands! :gunshooting:

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sat Feb 25, 2017 11:54 pm


No Picture

General Homesteading Topics • Re: Storeing Oil / Lard

February 26, 2017 Murby 0
jean11 wrote:
I’ve been saving my bacon grease in the refrig until I have enough to pressure can a number of pints. My first batch of bacon grease I filled to within 1 inch of the top of the pint jar – and I learned that was a mistake. The boiling grease splattered the rim of the pint jar during processing, and those jars did not seal. I now fill the jars 2 to 2 1/2 inches from the top and no longer have the problem. My next canning project is to can 8 pounds of butter. I canned butter one other time and the processing turned out fine. I learned a lesson here as well. The butter I bought was salted, and the end product was enough to make my hair stand up. This time I’m doing a mix of salted and unsalted which is what the recipe suggested in the first place.

The reason your grease boiled and splattered is the same reason your canned grease is probably going to go bad… Water!!

I would also comment that storing grease with meat in a fridge for more than a week will probably result in a spoiled product.

But I’m no expert..

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sat Feb 25, 2017 8:44 pm


No Picture

First Aid & Medicine • Re: Anesthesia – How?

February 26, 2017 Murby 0

Well folks, it looks like my anesthesia problem has been solved!

In a word “Ether”… yup.. it is that simple and its something the average person can purchase. Its also safe, well… safe in relative context. its easy to use and from what I can tell, seems to be the type of drug that allows one to select the level of sedation.

While I will be purchasing a small supply of it, I also learned its not even that difficult to make if one has access to a grade school level chemistry set.. (which I do).. and I’ve downloaded the instructions and a video on the procedure to manufacture it.

I’m not an expert on it obviously and still have much research to do.. but from what I can tell, I can buy a 500ml bottle for $50 that is enough to completely anesthetize at least 20 to 30 times….

Oh.. and by the way.. I’d also like to convey a bit of my own personal experience with “self administered anesthesia”… A few months ago, we slaughtered all our pigs as we normally do when it gets cold.. We also process all the meat ourselves. While I’ve been processing deer for years, its only in the past three years we started processing pigs too. So in light of all my complaining about sharp knives, my friend went out an bought me a Christmas gift this past winter.. A professional grade, general use butchering knife… This is a $75 piece of hardware that seems to be sharper than my brand new razors.. I was amazed when I started cutting.

So there I am, humming along, slicing and dicing with my new knife.. You all know where this is going don’t you? yup.. I did it.. Not being used to the cutting power of this wonderfully sharp instrument, I sliced my finger from knuckle to knuckle and all the way to the bone.. What really amazed me is that I felt the knife “bump” me, but didn’t feel it actually cut me.. and yet it opened me right up..

Damn that hurt.. I was starting to pour sweat, hot flashes, getting light headed, and I knew darn well that my wife was going to have to clean it out (raw pork!) and then close it up. I could have gone to the hospital, there’s a clinic just a few miles down the road, but I didn’t want to go through that.

So, I self medicated myself with something called a “Whippet” that contains nitrous oxide.. As soon as a sucked in my first breath, I was instantly relaxed.. My heart rate normalized, I stopped sweating, and I felt a whole lot better… I could still feel the pain but it didn’t bother me anymore. My wife dunked my finger in some hydrogen peroxide, hit it with some iodine, (or is it iodide?), and then let it air dry.. Once it was dried, she super-glued it together, and then wrapped it up.

How nice it was to have that nitrous around and a whippet cracker to dump it into a party balloon…

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sat Feb 25, 2017 8:41 pm


No Picture

Check In Here Michigan Preppers • Re: Prepping since Jan2016 South East Lapeer County

February 25, 2017 Murby 0

We are on a private well but we also have a pond.

I have a 6000 watt Coleman generator that I converted to tri-fuel so it can use gasoline, natural gas, or low pressure propane. I have the skills and fabrication tools needed to build almost anything I want.. Including a wood gassifier to power the generator if need be. Of course, skills and tools don’t mean much if you don’t have materials to work with right? I also have empty propane tanks of all sizes, lots and lots of 55 gallon drums (both steel and plastic), and plenty of structural steel laying around.

Our house is mostly natural gas but I do have an electric clothes dryer.. I’ve already installed piping to convert it to natural gas if I choose.

As part of our prepping, we are installing an 8000 watt ground mount grid tie solar system this year and I’m going to be ordering 1000 watts of extra panels to store in the basement in a Faraday cage.. Once I have those, I’ll also buy a few dc-ac inverters.. probably a mix of pure-sine and modified sign to run different things.

Our main heat source is a natural gas forced air furnace but we never use it. We mostly heat with wood in the winter.

We do have a garden.. in fact, we have three of them.. a very large plot and two smaller plots. You can’t grow certain things in the same area together because if they cross pollinate they mess each other up.

I also have a single row grape vineyard sort-to-speak.. We have 4 grape plants that are 6 years mature.. not sure if I would count on those though because they can get wiped out by the grape fungus every year if we don’t spray them weekly.

We also have a few apple trees, pear trees, and a cherry tree.. Only 4 years old so not mature yet.

I also have a very nice chicken coop.. Insulated, towable, and has a built in solar powered automatic door.. It can hold about 30 birds but we gave them away last year when the price of eggs dropped to under $1/dozen.
Along with the coop, I also have a 1 acre fenced in area for pigs.. We just slaughtered them all this past December so I currently have about 500 lbs of meat stored and we’re making ham and pork soup for canning every weekend.

I have 3 bee hives but no bee’s.. My buddy 1/4 mile away has 40+ hives so its not a problem. We have about 2 gallons of honey stored.

We’re getting there.. this summer we’ll be concentrating on the solar system install and new weapons.. Buying the wife a COLT AR15, 10 mags and about 1000 rounds of ammo to go along with my AR10.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sat Feb 25, 2017 1:02 pm


No Picture

Check In Here Michigan Preppers • Prepping since Jan2016 South East Lapeer County

February 25, 2017 Murby 0

Hello,
Just thought I’d join in. The wife and I have been prepping for the past couple months. We are stocking up on food, meds, guns and ammo as well as building a Faraday cage to store a laptop and DVD’s full of survival information as well as a digital mini-library on any subject we could possibly think of that might be useful. We’re also storing a CB radio, ham radio, and various other electrically delicate items.

Our property is surrounded by farm fields and the main town (population ~2500) is about 2 miles away (1.5 the way the crow flies) houses along our street are spaced several hundred of yards apart and wood lines and tree lines are between.

We are on very good terms with our neighbors.. they’re older folks but they have six children.. two of which live in the local area. They also have two large ponds with lots and lots of fish.. We have a small pond ourselves.

We are still under-prepared by most measures but we are quickly building up. My home sits about 500 feet back from the road so we do have a bit of a defensive position but it could be improved.

Anyhow.. just thought I’d say hi..

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:12 am


General Preparedness Discussion • Re: FEBRUARY 2017- What Did You Do To Prep This Week/Month?

February 23, 2017 Murby 0
air commando wrote:

Murby wrote:Just vacuum canned 50 lbs of powdered whole eggs into 1/2 gallon jars. It works out to 1850 eggs or 12 gallons or 24 +1 of the half gallon jars.

Since they are just vacuum canned where do you store them and how long will they last? Where did you buy 50# of powdered whole egg?

We vacuum canned them AND put in an oxygen absorber.. Our vacuum pulls down to 29 inches so its far better than a food saver. I then pack the 1/2 gallon jars into cardboard boxes in our food storage pantry in the basement to keep out the light.. its cool down there. Should last 15 to 20 years under heavy vacuum. I suppose a mylar bag with oxygen absorber would probably get you 10 to 15 years at least… maybe 20.

I’m an engineer and did some design work for a large factory that produces the powdered eggs. I called up the plant manager and asked him if I could buy a box and he sent me an entire pallet of them for free.. I ended up with ten boxes at 50 lbs each on a pallet.. They’re delicious! I can’t even tell the difference between real eggs or powdered when my wife makes french toast or an omelette.

I kept one box and sold the other nine.. they didn’t even last a week at $180 per box. A 50lb box is the rough equivalent of around 1800 eggs.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Thu Feb 23, 2017 12:16 pm


No Picture

General Preparedness Discussion • Re: FEBRUARY 2017- What Did You Do To Prep This Week/Month?

February 22, 2017 Murby 0

Just added 2 gallons of cheap vodka, 24 cans (1 case) of store bought canned peas, +24 cans of mixed vegetables, +24 cans of corn… (they were all on sale for buy 1 get one free).

Decided that my single Armalite AR10 should not be the only high powered combat firearm in the home so I’ve started looking at purchasing an AR15 chambered in 556. Considering a Daniel Defense or LWRC with 10 mags and an AimPoint Pro red dot sight.. still deciding on that.

I have also built up a stock of open top 55 gallon drums.. If SHTF happens, I plan to use the loader to fill them with dirt for use as bullet proof cover positions. I currently have about 60 of them.

We’re only on our 2nd month of prepping so we’re still in full steam mode..

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Wed Feb 22, 2017 5:45 pm


No Picture

First Aid & Medicine • Re: Anesthesia – How?

February 21, 2017 Murby 0

I wonder if morphine might be a better solution.. How long does it take to grow poppy plants in a SHTF world? How much technical knowledge to turn that into something useful? Can’t be too difficult since the drug cartels do it all day long..

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Mon Feb 20, 2017 8:50 pm


No Picture

First Aid & Medicine • Re: Anesthesia – How?

February 18, 2017 Murby 0

This is turning out to be more complicated than I was initially giving it credit for… Lots more work to be done.

You all have to admit, being able to successfully anesthetize someone in a SHFT situation could make life a lot easier and a lot less ugly when it comes to the inevitable injuries that will occur.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sat Feb 18, 2017 2:20 pm


No Picture

General Food Topics • Re: Wacky LDS calculator or am I missing something?

February 18, 2017 Murby 0
RockinB wrote:
We used this calculator as a guide too. Our family numbers are a lot higher and we are very close on the quantities in the main “shtf” category’s that matter to us.
We’re finished prepping “shtf” food storage and have no intentions of ever using it. Peace of mind without maintaining a rigorous rotation schedule works best for us.

Well that’s certainly one way of doing it.. I plan on doing the same with our wheat berries.. Not really interested in wasting my time grinding them up so hopefully they turn out to be a waste of money.

But our canned soups are delicious.. better than anything that comes out of a cambells soup can.. I eat our canned foods all the time and I don’t do it reluctantly.. After working outside in the cold weather, its nice to be able to pop a quart jar of soup into the microwave and have it ready in 4 minutes.

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sat Feb 18, 2017 10:14 am


No Picture

First Aid & Medicine • Re: Anesthesia – How?

February 18, 2017 Murby 0
DR1VENbyKNOWLEDGE wrote:
Regardless of the discussions a forum might bring on homebrewed concoctions, it’s just too dangerous to have this discussion for the idiots that might read it later and think they’re a super educated DIY’er and kills an entire family at home accidently practicing their newfound internet skills….Not a good idea at all even if you didn’t care about the illegal aspect of it.

No, I’m sorry but I completely disagree.. Basing one’s conversations on the potential actions of others is no different than saying “We shouldn’t sell guns because people might hurt themselves”

I agree with most here…more harm than good. Risk outweighs the benefits for the patient.

Don’t forget the versatility of a human to begin with…. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aron_Ralston

In grid-down/SHTF scenarios, there’s just going to be death in some situations period….You’ll do what you can, sure, of course….. But without sterile environments with trained medical personnel, in some situations you’re just going to die. End of story.

I don’t agree with this either but I do understand your point.. As for the risk/reward profile, that’s the whole point of the conversation… to improve that profile in some way if possible.. and if its not possible then so be it.. but we’ll never know if its not explored. Maybe complete unconsciousness isn’t safe or practical, but maybe 90% is?

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sat Feb 18, 2017 2:49 am


No Picture

First Aid & Medicine • Re: Anesthesia – How?

February 18, 2017 Murby 0
Matte wrote:

Murby wrote:If you needed a limb amputated or a bullet pulled, would you rather die in your sleep from an anesthetic mistake or die in agony from shock?? Not sure about everyone else but I’d choose the anesthesia.

That’s interesting, from the standpoints of say needing an emergency anesthetic for amputating a trapped limb to free a victim or for use as a euthanasia drug (whether that was the intent or not). If it was my arm that was mangled and stuck in a piece of equipment, or my leg trapped under building debris, I might agree that you anesthetize me before taking a hacksaw to my limb.

Still not understanding why you want to manufacture an anesthetic agent yourself however. You wouldn’t be able to produce an agent nearly as pure as even lab grade reagent quality in your kitchen, it’ll require time to do so that you may not have, the supplies and equipment would likely be ten times or more the cost of just purchasing it, and the purchased product will come in an appropriate container (with preservatives and stabilizers, if needed) for transport and storage already. Why make it?

ya! You’re in the same boat as me.. Either put me down or put the hacksaw down!

I’m just wondering what it would take to manufacture the stuff.. I’m an engineer and frequently have to perform lab level testing for clients to verify process parameters for certain production lines. I have a rudimentary laboratory in my basement.. Things like temperature controlled water baths, centrifuge, glassware, Metler-Toledo scales that go to 0.0001 grams, conductivity meters, microscope, vacuum chambers, high temperature oven, etc..

I’m totally unaware of the complexities, which is why I brought the subject up. You’d think that some kind of “knock you unconscious” drug would be a good thing to have for SHTF..

Statistics: Posted by Murby — Sat Feb 18, 2017 2:43 am